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Postby geoff.london » 02 Mar 2013, 19:26

There is a very nice and early piece of , I believe, the Codman show on the movietone news website. You don't need to register, just go to the site and search 'Punch Judy'. I'd send a link but previous attempts have failed. Geoff.
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Re: movietone news

Postby Richard Coombs » 03 Mar 2013, 12:34

Cheer Geoff .

I just popped along to Movietone News and put in Punch and Judy as you suggested , and a couple of pages of links came up.

Most clips only contain a shot or two of punch in full swing ( often a good many seconds longer of the entranced faces of the children watching )...but all are worth a look .

I had never thought of looking on there before , so thank you for the suggestion.

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Re: movietone news

Postby geoff.london » 03 Mar 2013, 22:10

You're welcome Richard. The Codman piece is the first one on the list. It says its 1850 but I suspect its later. The show is clearly seen in full swing in the background. Geoff.
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Re: movietone news

Postby CvdC » 03 Mar 2013, 23:04

Yes Richard that Cod piece is indeed interesting.
1852!!! I should think not. How could they allow that sort of mistake?
Here's a long shot
http://www.movietone.com/N_POPUP_Player ... tno=132557
Looks like a Tickner Punch in use.
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Re: movietone news

Postby Richard Coombs » 04 Mar 2013, 11:38

That is the Longest clip of the bunch .

I just adore how the children look ...they are what my Gran would have called "two -penneth of God-Help-Us"

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Re: movietone news

Postby Chris » 04 Mar 2013, 12:43

Geoff, if the one you refer to as possibly Codman is SS1503/3 then it certainly is Llandudno Codman. It is stated to be 1852 (not 1850) but I agree with you that it must be later. Firstly the fashions seem later but also, as you are sure to know, the Codman show didn't appear in Llandudno until 1860. Also you will probably remember that the show wasn't initially on the promenade at all. It was only after Codman had performed for at least one season on the Orme (the area we now call Happy Valley) that the Council relented and allowed him a promenade pitch.
But the film is definitely Llandudno Codman - I have a postcard photograph showing that position for the booth, and that tree on the right of the picture. Also the final shot of the clip is unmistakably of Llandudno pier with the old Grand Hotel.
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Re: movietone news

Postby Professor Joe » 06 Mar 2013, 10:19

I agree with you there Chris, The man in the foreground is wearing a boater, which were worn from the late 19th century. But later in the film there are three young boys wearing eaton collars, which could mean it's at least 1890+
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Re: movietone news

Postby geoff.london » 06 Mar 2013, 20:06

Many thanks for the clarification and correction Chris. I am thinking that this must be before the Bailey piece from 1901. Geoff.
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Re: movietone news

Postby Chris » 06 Mar 2013, 22:04

Well I'm not so sure of that Geoff. Certainly the fashions of the early 1900s continued those of the 1890s. What we can say is that this film is definitely post 1890. The Steamships didn't start until 1890 and the new Landing Stage (featured) wasn't built until 1891. And since the first commercial film came in 1895, then this film must be later than that. But there's nothing I can see to put it before 1901. Actually the quality of the film suggests to me a later rather than an earlier date. Of course it isn't a Movietone newsreel, they didn't start until 1929. But it is professionally done and there is no jerkiness in the movement, so it is probably taken well into the silent era. Now the first talkie was in 1927 but silent films continued into the thirties. So we can say that this film of Llandudno Punch was probably somewhere between 1896 and 1929 - but the fashion suggests before the 1920s and that plus the subject matter suggests pre the 1914-18 war. If I had to guess I'd go for 1908 - fashion became a touch more opulent from 1910 onwards.
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Re: movietone news

Postby geoff.london » 07 Mar 2013, 21:31

Many thanks again, Chris, for this extra information. Geoff
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