CRB Check

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CRB Check

Postby Robanti » 31 Jan 2007, 12:36

I have got my CRB cert!!!! Nice to have a certificate to prove I am NOT a criminal!

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Postby Peter » 31 Jan 2007, 16:07

We know a local P & J man who boasts of a CRB certificate.
When asked when he got this he proudly states "Five years ago"
Even the greasy spoon's (sorry I mean cafes in the parks) staff have to renew their basic health & hygiene certificates after 3 years.
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Postby lesclarke » 31 Jan 2007, 17:51

There was a quite comprehensive article on CRB checks in the last PJF Swazzle by Mrs Back2Front. Regarding expiry date she mentioned that there is no expiry date. Logically speaking, any certificate, as with any health check can only say that you are 'checked out' up to that date of the check.
Before CRBs, one could get a Police Check, unlike CRBs one could apply oneself, the cost was £10 and I was informed by the police that they lasted - only 6 months. CRBs are more comprehensive, with two levels available, and enquiring recently I was told that they advised new checks to be made every 3 years.
However, the employment agency I recently did mine through pointed out that the level of the CRB check you apply for, and how often you make a new application depends more on those asking to see the CRB cetificate, as it is they that must be satisfied. In other words, a parent may well be happy just to see a certificate, but an organistaion offering closer work with children may insist on the enhanced level of disclosure, and have their own idea of how often renewal is required. I believe my local health authourity, and council require annual renewals in some cases.
Personally, I intend to get a new certificate every 3 years, I applied for the Enhanced, which is about £10 more, just in case someone asks for it.
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Postby David Wilde » 31 Jan 2007, 19:28

We know your not a criminal Tony,and Ive seen you dance!
Im above all this!!
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Postby mrmarmalade » 31 Jan 2007, 22:01

The thing that suits me about the CRB is that they know nothing about me

At least, that is all they say.
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Postby Peter » 31 Jan 2007, 23:54

My niece provides short term foster care for children for the local council.
She and her whole family (husband and children over 16 years) have to have a new CRB check every year and are told to apply 3 months in advance because it can take that long.
Let's hope it never gets to that state for the P & J fraternity.
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Postby Tony James » 01 Feb 2007, 12:55

As I read the exclusions on the back of the certificate it is only good on the day it was issued based on the information then available which might or might not be up to date.

And that information is only about England & Wales, to some limited extent on Scottish information but nothing from Northern Ireland. So you could have a record there but the CRB don't know.

Reassuring isn't it?

The fact is these checks have nothing to do with protecting children. They are to do with protecting local government personnel who are scared that in years to come they will be accused of failing in some area because of accusations made about events today.

When you see what has happened with retrospective accusations over the last 25 years you can understand their concerns.
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Postby Tony James » 01 Feb 2007, 13:02

Last june or July, in answer to concerns about the need to have a CRB Certificate for Punch & Judy poeple, the CRB responded that Punch & Judy did not involve direct contact with the children.

Therefore, a cetifcate was unnecessery. This advice went to local authorities who had raised the question at very short notice.

Those authorities are now ignoring that advice as, of course, they can if they choose. Which is why I've got mine and at Enhanced level because the word is out that this will be the required level soon.

Once again, some councils will demand, others won't.
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Postby Chris » 01 Feb 2007, 13:34

Since you appear travel widely I wouldn't think such a certificate any use whatsoever, since they only apply to the police authority area where issued.

Actually on the few occasions I have been asked I have asked them to check whether it was necessary - on the grounds that I was not a child minder, would not be in a one to one relationship with any child nor would I be in sole charge of the children. On each occasion they have backed down.

If we accept that these things are a necessity they will become so. Play their game and you'll find that in a few year's time we'll be needing a renewal every three months, for each county in which we work, and the fees will go up and up. Gently resist them is my advice. They were not designed for, nor are they required for the jobs we do.

Those performers who, foolishly in my opinion, advertise in their brochures etc. that they are CRB checked are making a rod for their backs and for everybody else as well. (Apparently they think it a selling point - to connect potential child abuse with a children's entertainer!) Parents booking kids parties will get the impression that these are now the norm, and soon we'll all have to be shelling out our £30 or £70 on a regular basis. It's all totally unnecessary. But as with the press and pc, and the licencing act, some of us are rather good at shooting ourselves in the foot.
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Postby Tony James » 01 Feb 2007, 14:05

Chris. I don't know about Police checks - they may only apply locally.

But a CRB check is national. It's the one required by local authorities for teachers and those - as they put it - in contact with children and vulnerable adults.

You have to supply lots of proven information going back years. It can take weeks and months for checks to be completed.

Like you I have not had many requests until recently. But local authorities are now iring it. This in spite of the advice from the CRB at Liverpool. This is coming from the central functions of local authorities when they organise town and city events.

Schools and nurseries have never asked. They've never even asked me about public liability insurance either though that has long been required centrally. Schools should ask but don't.
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Postby Chris » 01 Feb 2007, 15:52

That may be your understanding Tony, but the CRB themselves say that they do not support portability. As I understand it a CRB check is not only for a particular area but for a particular job. If you get another job you apply for another CRB check.
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Postby Tony James » 01 Feb 2007, 16:00

Well, that's not how it was put to me. And it's not how it's being used in practise.

A neighbour's daughter moved north to teach, starting Jamuary and the CRB check she brought with her from two years ago was perfectly acceptable by the education authorities up here.

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Postby Chris » 01 Feb 2007, 16:05

The the CRB website is totally wrong. Someone should explain it to them.
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Postby Tony James » 01 Feb 2007, 16:34

I've just looked at the CRB website, They don't say anything except the absolute obvious about the check ie It's only any good on the day of issue and thereafter it's out of date. Accept it at your own risk.

They're simply covering their backsides in all the other warnings about accepting any check 24 hours old or older.

I wouldn't expect them to gauarntee anything after that. Vehicle MOTs say the same thing.

It's down to the organiser but they know, even those in their soft cottonwool balled existances in local authorities, even they know that they cannot have a fresh CRB check for every entertainer, every time they work for them.

i said at the begining of my original post that the exclusions on the back rendered it worth rather less than the paper it's written on.

But that's what certain people require, it's all that's available and that's what's acceptable. With it you get the job or you don't. Without it, you don't. Take your pick.
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Postby Miraiker » 01 Feb 2007, 18:12

We just had our usual paperwork from the local borough council for a regular park spot we do through August.
For the first time ever they ask us to send, not only PLI but a CRB certificate.
We use the same approach as Chris.
A quick phone call to explain that we would not expect to be in sole charge of any children as this is family entertainment and that we have no direct contact with the children. Indeed Equity guidlines state that we should not be in sole charge of the children we are entertaining. Are you sure it's necessary?
They immediately said it wasn't necessary and to ignore the request.
This has always been the response so far.
I also work in schools a lot and do not require a CRB certificate as a teacher is present and in charge.
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